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Worst-in-country SATs results are challenged
DOUBTS have been cast on
the system that has branded
Southampton's 11-year-olds
bottom of the class in the
country.
This year's SATs results have placed
the city's youngsters at the bottom of
the class for English, with fewer pupils
achieving the expected level than anywhere
else in England.
But Southampton City Council is
refusing to accept the results are valid,
after yet more problems with the marking
system were revealed.
One school says its figures mistakenly
make it look like it is failing because of
an apparent administrative error.
The tests for primary school children
have been plagued with controversy,
with massive delays in getting exam
papers marked and back to schools, and
heavy criticism of the grades handed
out.
Now the results have finally been
released they show Southampton has a
higher percentage of youngsters failing
to reach the expected level four in
English than anywhere else.
Just 70 per cent made the grade, compared
with 82 per cent in Hampshire,
and the national average of 81 per cent.
Across the three Rs - reading, writing
and arithmetic - less than half of
Southampton's 11-year-olds achieved the
expected level.
The 49 per cent of pupils achieving
level four in each of the disciplines gives
the city the joint third-worst record in
England, level with Portsmouth and
only better than the City of London (34
per cent) and Isle of Wight (48 per cent).
Serious doubts have been raised about
the figures because of the experiences at
one Southampton school.
According to the Department for
Children, Schools and Families, just 60
per cent of pupils at Sholing Junior
School achieved level four in their
English tests. Alarmed by the statistic,
staff examined the figures in closer
detail, discovering that 20 children had
been marked as not sitting the exams -
even though their papers had been
marked and returned to the school.
All had attained level four or above,
meaning the correct percentage of
pupils reaching the grade is actually 98.
Deputy head Richard Hutchinson said:
"The 20 children whose papers have
been recorded as absent have all been
marked - they were all returned to us in
the same bag. I think it's absolutely outrageous.
A third of our English results
appear to be null and void."
As well as problems with the statistics,
Mr Hutchinson says he is very concerned
by the standard of marking.
"The people who have been doing the
marking are a whole level out. It's quite
simply appalling. We feel more disappointed
for the children than anything
else. It seems they have been very poorly
rewarded for their hard work."
A spokesman for the Qualifications
and Curriculum Authority apologised
for the delay and said results issued so
far were only provisional and any mistakes
would be rectified by tomorrow.
The figures for individual schools are
not released at this stage, and will only
be used towards league tables once
errors have been corrected, he added.
He confirmed that all papers had been
marked by teachers who have all been
thoroughly assessed, but schools were
able to appeal against grades for individuals
and groups of pupils.
12:27pm Thursday 7th August 2008
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CommentPosted by: Spellchecker on 12:34pm Thu 7 Aug 08
if da standerd ov engleesh on ear is anyfing too go buy.
i think them figers our probly abowt rite.
if da standerd ov engleesh on ear is anyfing too go buy.
i think them figers our probly abowt rite.
Posted by: Carry Mung, New Forest on 12:41pm Thu 7 Aug 08
SATs will be scrapped within two years, I guarantee it.
Remember where you heard this first.
SATs will be scrapped within two years, I guarantee it.
Remember where you heard this first.
Posted by: Bright Spark, stubinton on 1:00pm Thu 7 Aug 08
i woz educkated in soufampton you kno innit an it dint do me no harm like
i woz educkated in soufampton you kno innit an it dint do me no harm like
Posted by: saddened, Southampton on 1:00pm Thu 7 Aug 08
I am not surprised as the children never seem to go to school. Parents should ensure they speak good english before they go to school, disciplined,able to concentrate on tasks and able to do basic tasks for themselves - it is the parent's responsibility not the schools.
I am not surprised as the children never seem to go to school. Parents should ensure they speak good english before they go to school, disciplined,able to concentrate on tasks and able to do basic tasks for themselves - it is the parent's responsibility not the schools.
Posted by: southy, redbridge on 1:09pm Thu 7 Aug 08
might help if the english mark there own exams and not let go to the americans to mark them,when you think how they spell some of there words like colour = color humour = humor whitch = witch ect ect, and yes i know my english bad,
might help if the english mark there own exams and not let go to the americans to mark them,when you think how they spell some of there words like colour = color humour = humor whitch = witch ect ect, and yes i know my english bad,
Posted by: Iain, Lordshill on 1:11pm Thu 7 Aug 08
[quote][bold]Bright Spark[/bold] wrote:
i woz educkated in soufampton you kno innit an it dint do me no harm like [/quote] No they won't. They'll be "re-branded" and relaunched as exactly the same as before, only with even more tedious bureaucracy for the teachers, confusion for the children and parents, and even less relevance to how well children are actually progressing.
I don't have any insider knowledge on this, it just appears to have been education policy for the past twenty years.
Bright Spark wrote:
i woz educkated in soufampton you kno innit an it dint do me no harm like
No they won't. They'll be "re-branded" and relaunched as exactly the same as before, only with even more tedious bureaucracy for the teachers, confusion for the children and parents, and even less relevance to how well children are actually progressing.
I don't have any insider knowledge on this, it just appears to have been education policy for the past twenty years.
Posted by: Concerned Parents on 1:18pm Thu 7 Aug 08
[quote][bold]saddened[/bold] wrote:
I am not surprised as the children never seem to go to school. Parents should ensure they speak good english before they go to school, disciplined,able to concentrate on tasks and able to do basic tasks for themselves - it is the parent's responsibility not the schools. [/quote] When our daughter started school we were reprimanded because she could count to thirty, and could recite the alphabet unassisted.
We were informed we were pushing her too hard.
saddened wrote:
I am not surprised as the children never seem to go to school. Parents should ensure they speak good english before they go to school, disciplined,able to concentrate on tasks and able to do basic tasks for themselves - it is the parent's responsibility not the schools.
When our daughter started school we were reprimanded because she could count to thirty, and could recite the alphabet unassisted.
We were informed we were pushing her too hard.
Posted by: Sunny Saint, Essex on 1:51pm Thu 7 Aug 08
As there is no reason to assume that Southampton is no different to any other City vis-à-vis the marking problems. Then is it safe to say that by that reckoning Southampton would still have finished in exactly the same place!
As there is no reason to assume that Southampton is no different to any other City vis-à-vis the marking problems. Then is it safe to say that by that reckoning Southampton would still have finished in exactly the same place!
Posted by: string bean, w on 1:52pm Thu 7 Aug 08
My 11 yr old has just got his SATs results, all the SATs are for is to see how the teachers perform, not the kids. Which is why teachers need all of these training days, because half of them are no good.
My 11 yr old has just got his SATs results, all the SATs are for is to see how the teachers perform, not the kids. Which is why teachers need all of these training days, because half of them are no good.
Posted by: Dave, Eastleigh on 1:59pm Thu 7 Aug 08
[quote][bold]string bean[/bold] wrote:
My 11 yr old has just got his SATs results, all the SATs are for is to see how the teachers perform, not the kids. Which is why teachers need all of these training days, because half of them are no good.[/quote] Mate, my girlfriend is a teacher, and after 4 years of training she works almost 12 hours a day, 6 days a week and then carries on working through her holidays. She gets paid less than most other professions. Then she has to also put up with mouth from kids and also parents. Some kids just don't want to learn, and some parents just don't want to know. I'd like to see you or your nipper put that much dedication into what you do for little to no reward. Its easy to criticize mate, but trying doing it yourself and see how long you last.
string bean wrote:
My 11 yr old has just got his SATs results, all the SATs are for is to see how the teachers perform, not the kids. Which is why teachers need all of these training days, because half of them are no good.
Mate, my girlfriend is a teacher, and after 4 years of training she works almost 12 hours a day, 6 days a week and then carries on working through her holidays. She gets paid less than most other professions. Then she has to also put up with mouth from kids and also parents. Some kids just don't want to learn, and some parents just don't want to know. I'd like to see you or your nipper put that much dedication into what you do for little to no reward. Its easy to criticize mate, but trying doing it yourself and see how long you last.
Posted by: Tylenol, Eastleigh on 2:01pm Thu 7 Aug 08
[quote][bold]Dave[/bold] wrote:
[quote][bold]string bean[/bold] wrote: My 11 yr old has just got his SATs results, all the SATs are for is to see how the teachers perform, not the kids. Which is why teachers need all of these training days, because half of them are no good.[/quote] Mate, my girlfriend is a teacher, and after 4 years of training she works almost 12 hours a day, 6 days a week and then carries on working through her holidays. She gets paid less than most other professions. Then she has to also put up with mouth from kids and also parents. Some kids just don't want to learn, and some parents just don't want to know. I'd like to see you or your nipper put that much dedication into what you do for little to no reward. Its easy to criticize mate, but trying doing it yourself and see how long you last.[/quote] Yeah, well said Dave. I bet his son is a loser who got rubbish marks in his SATs. My parents were proud of me!! I got amazing results!
Dave wrote:
string bean wrote: My 11 yr old has just got his SATs results, all the SATs are for is to see how the teachers perform, not the kids. Which is why teachers need all of these training days, because half of them are no good.
Mate, my girlfriend is a teacher, and after 4 years of training she works almost 12 hours a day, 6 days a week and then carries on working through her holidays. She gets paid less than most other professions. Then she has to also put up with mouth from kids and also parents. Some kids just don't want to learn, and some parents just don't want to know. I'd like to see you or your nipper put that much dedication into what you do for little to no reward. Its easy to criticize mate, but trying doing it yourself and see how long you last.
Yeah, well said Dave. I bet his son is a loser who got rubbish marks in his SATs. My parents were proud of me!! I got amazing results!
Posted by: The Truth, You know where I am on 2:07pm Thu 7 Aug 08
[quote][bold]string bean[/bold] wrote:
My 11 yr old has just got his SATs results, all the SATs are for is to see how the teachers perform, not the kids. Which is why teachers need all of these training days, because half of them are no good.[/quote] I hope your son failed miserably. Then he will be a failure in life. Like you.
string bean wrote:
My 11 yr old has just got his SATs results, all the SATs are for is to see how the teachers perform, not the kids. Which is why teachers need all of these training days, because half of them are no good.
I hope your son failed miserably. Then he will be a failure in life. Like you.
Posted by: the vengeful cabbage on 2:19pm Thu 7 Aug 08
Wow hard to think why kidz is so thick these dayz. I mean maths is gud coz they can work out the markup to put on the skunk they iz flogging. The writin iz gud coz they is allwayz taggin for dere crew. The reading must be whats letting us down.
Wow hard to think why kidz is so thick these dayz. I mean maths is gud coz they can work out the markup to put on the skunk they iz flogging. The writin iz gud coz they is allwayz taggin for dere crew. The reading must be whats letting us down.
Posted by: I Ronic on 2:31pm Thu 7 Aug 08
[quote]DOUBTS have been cast on the system that has branded Southampton's 11-year-olds bottom of the class in the country.[/quote]
But City of London is below Southampton, as is the Isle of Wight so how is Southampton bottom?
DOUBTS have been cast on the system that has branded Southampton's 11-year-olds bottom of the class in the country.
But City of London is below Southampton, as is the Isle of Wight so how is Southampton bottom?
Posted by: string bean, wiltshire on 3:11pm Thu 7 Aug 08
BORING
Posted by: Stuart Jebbitt, Eastleigh and Thornhill on 3:51pm Thu 7 Aug 08
It'll be even worse when Fluoridation comes in. Research in China, shows that it, (fluoridation), lowers IQs.
How many more chemicals are we going to pump into our childrens heads?
No wonder they have low levels of concentration.
It'll be even worse when Fluoridation comes in. Research in China, shows that it, (fluoridation), lowers IQs.
How many more chemicals are we going to pump into our childrens heads?
No wonder they have low levels of concentration.
Posted by: Man about Mansbridge, Mansbridge on 5:17pm Thu 7 Aug 08
A load of kids on our estate never go to School so this is where
the system is not working.
A load of kids on our estate never go to School so this is where
the system is not working.
Posted by: Sceptic, Waterside on 6:26pm Thu 7 Aug 08
[quote][bold]Carry Mung[/bold] wrote:
SATs will be scrapped within two years, I guarantee it. Remember where you heard this first.[/quote] You only hang round Barry because he's famous, don't you :-)
Carry Mung wrote:
SATs will be scrapped within two years, I guarantee it. Remember where you heard this first.
You only hang round Barry because he's famous, don't you :-)
Posted by: sotonian, southampton on 6:46pm Thu 7 Aug 08
[quote][bold]southy[/bold] wrote:
might help if the english mark there own exams and not let go to the americans to mark them,when you think how they spell some of there words like colour = color humour = humor whitch = witch ect ect, and yes i know my english bad,[/quote] for your information Southy exam papers are marked by british people , most of them are teachers or ex teachers , it is just the firm that is American, I know this because a friend of mine is a chief marker and he is totally british
southy wrote:
might help if the english mark there own exams and not let go to the americans to mark them,when you think how they spell some of there words like colour = color humour = humor whitch = witch ect ect, and yes i know my english bad,
for your information Southy exam papers are marked by british people , most of them are teachers or ex teachers , it is just the firm that is American, I know this because a friend of mine is a chief marker and he is totally british
Posted by: gristle, soton on 7:49pm Thu 7 Aug 08
My schooling took place in the East midlands during the 50's and 60's.
I attended a Secondary modern school, and was fairly average - always 'A' stream, but never the top half of the class.
I moved to Southampton during the 70's and one of my first impressions was how ignorant most local folk were. Not unintelligent - but lacking in education.
To be honest, over the years, nothing seems to have changed much
My schooling took place in the East midlands during the 50's and 60's.
I attended a Secondary modern school, and was fairly average - always 'A' stream, but never the top half of the class.
I moved to Southampton during the 70's and one of my first impressions was how ignorant most local folk were. Not unintelligent - but lacking in education.
To be honest, over the years, nothing seems to have changed much
Posted by: parent, SOTON on 8:08pm Thu 7 Aug 08
Anyone know where we can view the individual marks for each school?
Anyone know where we can view the individual marks for each school?
Posted by: Jim, Southampton on 8:29pm Thu 7 Aug 08
[quote][bold]Concerned Parents[/bold] wrote:
[quote][bold]saddened[/bold] wrote: I am not surprised as the children never seem to go to school. Parents should ensure they speak good english before they go to school, disciplined,able to concentrate on tasks and able to do basic tasks for themselves - it is the parent's responsibility not the schools. [/quote] When our daughter started school we were reprimanded because she could count to thirty, and could recite the alphabet unassisted. We were informed we were pushing her too hard.[/quote] Oh God, really? My daughter knows the alphabet, can count to more or less 40, but also speaks Japanese, Spanish and English (thats not a joke, its a multi-lingual household).
Concerned Parents wrote:
saddened wrote: I am not surprised as the children never seem to go to school. Parents should ensure they speak good english before they go to school, disciplined,able to concentrate on tasks and able to do basic tasks for themselves - it is the parent's responsibility not the schools.
When our daughter started school we were reprimanded because she could count to thirty, and could recite the alphabet unassisted. We were informed we were pushing her too hard.
Oh God, really? My daughter knows the alphabet, can count to more or less 40, but also speaks Japanese, Spanish and English (thats not a joke, its a multi-lingual household).
Posted by: Rocket, Southampton on 9:40pm Thu 7 Aug 08
[quote][bold]Jim[/bold] wrote:
[quote][bold]Concerned Parents[/bold] wrote: [quote][bold]saddened[/bold] wrote: I am not surprised as the children never seem to go to school. Parents should ensure they speak good english before they go to school, disciplined,able to concentrate on tasks and able to do basic tasks for themselves - it is the parent's responsibility not the schools. [/quote] When our daughter started school we were reprimanded because she could count to thirty, and could recite the alphabet unassisted. We were informed we were pushing her too hard.[/quote] Oh God, really? My daughter knows the alphabet, can count to more or less 40, but also speaks Japanese, Spanish and English (thats not a joke, its a multi-lingual household).[/quote] Not a good thing though, I can speak 5 different languages, ENGLISH, SCOTTISH, IRISH, AMERICAN & CANADIAN, Never had much education apart from the 11+
Jim wrote:
Concerned Parents wrote: saddened wrote: I am not surprised as the children never seem to go to school. Parents should ensure they speak good english before they go to school, disciplined,able to concentrate on tasks and able to do basic tasks for themselves - it is the parent's responsibility not the schools.
When our daughter started school we were reprimanded because she could count to thirty, and could recite the alphabet unassisted. We were informed we were pushing her too hard.
Oh God, really? My daughter knows the alphabet, can count to more or less 40, but also speaks Japanese, Spanish and English (thats not a joke, its a multi-lingual household).
Not a good thing though, I can speak 5 different languages, ENGLISH, SCOTTISH, IRISH, AMERICAN & CANADIAN, Never had much education apart from the 11+
Posted by: ANON, Southampton on 9:43pm Thu 7 Aug 08
I say this with the UTMOST RESPECT, but I feel that the huge amount of non-English pupils are getting the attention, which pulls the correct education away from the English. Look at St. Marks - recently on GMTV with over 50% of the school being non-English; this is what we have come to thanks to Europe.
I say this with the UTMOST RESPECT, but I feel that the huge amount of non-English pupils are getting the attention, which pulls the correct education away from the English. Look at St. Marks - recently on GMTV with over 50% of the school being non-English; this is what we have come to thanks to Europe.
Posted by: Rocket, Southampton on 10:04pm Thu 7 Aug 08
[quote][bold]ANON[/bold] wrote:
I say this with the UTMOST RESPECT, but I feel that the huge amount of non-English pupils are getting the attention, which pulls the correct education away from the English. Look at St. Marks - recently on GMTV with over 50% of the school being non-English; this is what we have come to thanks to Europe.[/quote] Totaly agree with you, 50% or more jobs will go to the non ENGLISH, BYE BYE ENGLAND, that is all I can say, what will we be called next ? Polenglandwearecheep
a.Com.co.UK
ANON wrote:
I say this with the UTMOST RESPECT, but I feel that the huge amount of non-English pupils are getting the attention, which pulls the correct education away from the English. Look at St. Marks - recently on GMTV with over 50% of the school being non-English; this is what we have come to thanks to Europe.
Totaly agree with you, 50% or more jobs will go to the non ENGLISH, BYE BYE ENGLAND, that is all I can say, what will we be called next ? Polenglandwearecheep
a.Com.co.UK
Posted by: Rocket, Southampton on 10:05pm Thu 7 Aug 08
[quote][bold]ANON[/bold] wrote:
I say this with the UTMOST RESPECT, but I feel that the huge amount of non-English pupils are getting the attention, which pulls the correct education away from the English. Look at St. Marks - recently on GMTV with over 50% of the school being non-English; this is what we have come to thanks to Europe.[/quote] Totaly agree with you, 50% or more jobs will go to the non ENGLISH, BYE BYE ENGLAND, that is all I can say, what will we be called next ? Polenglandwearecheep
a.Com.co.UK
ANON wrote:
I say this with the UTMOST RESPECT, but I feel that the huge amount of non-English pupils are getting the attention, which pulls the correct education away from the English. Look at St. Marks - recently on GMTV with over 50% of the school being non-English; this is what we have come to thanks to Europe.
Totaly agree with you, 50% or more jobs will go to the non ENGLISH, BYE BYE ENGLAND, that is all I can say, what will we be called next ? Polenglandwearecheep
a.Com.co.UK
Posted by: Get it right, Hythe on 10:23pm Thu 7 Aug 08
[quote][bold]southy[/bold] wrote:
might help if the english mark there own exams and not let go to the americans to mark them,when you think how they spell some of there words like colour = color humour = humor whitch = witch ect ect, and yes i know my english bad,[/quote] Given that you know your English is sub-standard, there are times when, perhaps, you should just sit on your hands....
southy wrote:
might help if the english mark there own exams and not let go to the americans to mark them,when you think how they spell some of there words like colour = color humour = humor whitch = witch ect ect, and yes i know my english bad,
Given that you know your English is sub-standard, there are times when, perhaps, you should just sit on your hands....
Posted by: Condor Man, Southampton on 10:47pm Thu 7 Aug 08
Clive Webster must fall on his sword, he earns too much and has delivered poor results. In 2 weeks we'll see how bad the GCSE results are. How long can the LEA continue to be unchallenged over their appalling provision of education for our children?
Clive Webster must fall on his sword, he earns too much and has delivered poor results. In 2 weeks we'll see how bad the GCSE results are. How long can the LEA continue to be unchallenged over their appalling provision of education for our children?
Posted by: string bean, wiltshire on 11:10pm Thu 7 Aug 08
[quote][bold]Condor Man[/bold] wrote:
Clive Webster must fall on his sword, he earns too much and has delivered poor results. In 2 weeks we'll see how bad the GCSE results are. How long can the LEA continue to be unchallenged over their appalling provision of education for our children?[/quote] Totally agree. But before long English will be off the curriculum and be replaced by Polish.....
Condor Man wrote:
Clive Webster must fall on his sword, he earns too much and has delivered poor results. In 2 weeks we'll see how bad the GCSE results are. How long can the LEA continue to be unchallenged over their appalling provision of education for our children?
Totally agree. But before long English will be off the curriculum and be replaced by Polish.....
Posted by: Alf, Shirley on 12:37am Fri 8 Aug 08
[quote][bold]the vengeful cabbage[/bold] wrote:
Wow hard to think why kidz is so thick these dayz. I mean maths is gud coz they can work out the markup to put on the skunk they iz flogging. The writin iz gud coz they is allwayz taggin for dere crew. The reading must be whats letting us down. [/quote] With spelling like that & a name like yours no wonder your kid is a good for nothing!!!!!!!!
the vengeful cabbage wrote:
Wow hard to think why kidz is so thick these dayz. I mean maths is gud coz they can work out the markup to put on the skunk they iz flogging. The writin iz gud coz they is allwayz taggin for dere crew. The reading must be whats letting us down.
With spelling like that & a name like yours no wonder your kid is a good for nothing!!!!!!!!
Posted by: Robert on 4:58am Fri 8 Aug 08
The marking was divided between Whipsnade and Chester zoos, and these two establishments have an unblemished reputation.
The marking was divided between Whipsnade and Chester zoos, and these two establishments have an unblemished reputation.
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